A Royal Connection to Harcourt, Beaumont, and Hamilton

Edit: My connection to Statesman Alexander Hamilton is probably false. His Y-chromosome was I-m253. My Y-chromosome is I-m223. Sorry...

I have a German Y chromosome and that I am closely related to several people with the surname Vance or Wentz by DNA. These Vance and Wentz families trace their lineage back to Good King Wenceslas. However, I do have reason to think that some from the Wence family migrated to Scotland before coming to America. However, this blog is not about that. This is about a different migration that is through the Vikings and King Bernard “The Dane,” next the Harcourts, next the Beaumonts of France, and finally the Hamiltons, and to the best of my knowledge does not include Good King Wenceslas

What I posted below is most importantly a direct lineage that makes that route possible starting with me and my most recent ancestors with the present surname “Hamilton” with the my Y chromosome and following its connection to back to King Bernard "The Dane" through Humphrey de Vaux, a member of the noble Harcourt family descended from the Vikings, and shares a more recent common ancestor that seems true given the ancestry of USA Statesman Alexander Hamilton. One might be able to see this is important to me because I share my surname with the late Statesman Alexander Hamilton.

My lineage starting from Hamilton goes through the Hamilton knights of Cadzow back to Gilbert de Hambledon son of William de Hambledon who traveled to Scotland from the Beaumonts, a noble family in France. Then, further back the Beaumonts come from the German Harcourt family.

Why? Look below, there is Humphrey of the Harcourt family that goes by the name Vaux, which is an alternate spelling of Vance! Thus, I suggest that my link with the modern German Vance family is probably about 1,000 years old, starting from the Harcourts. This is how I could be related to the Vance family by DNA, but wound up with a different surname.

HARCOURTS BY OTHER NAMES

1. Torf. According to Robert of Torigny (GND, viii. c. 37), Torf was the father of Turold and Turchetil (see also OV ii. 12). It is wrongly assumed that this Turchetil was a forefather of the Harcourts; he died childless, passing his estate to his great-nephew, Asketil (cart. Preaux, fol. 97v; CP xi. Instr., col. 201 a. d., Du Monstier, Neustria Pia, p. 522, 1663). Turold mar. Duvelina de Crepon, sister of Gunnor, the wife of ‘Duke’ Richard; they were ancestors of the Beaumont family of Pont-Audemer, and, according to Auguste le Prevost, of the Harcourts, with Turold and Duvelina being the parents of both Onfroi de Vieilles (GND vii. 1. 3.), and Turchetil. (See Ordericus, ed. Prevost, vol. i., p. 180; ii. pp. 14, 369, 370; iii. pp. 42, 229).

1.1. Turchetil.

1.2. ‘Turoldis teneri ducis pedagogus perimitur’ (Will. Gemet, VII.).

1.2.1. Hunfrid (Onfroi de Vieilles, alias Vetulis or Vaux, lord of Vieilles; a small commune in the canton of Beaumont, arrondissement of Bernay. (Humphrey)

1.2.1.1. Roger de Beaumont; Asketil, his dapifer, being a junior kinsman.

1.2.1.1.1. Robert de Beaumont, Ist Earl Leicester.

1.2.1.1.1.1. Robert de Beaumont, 2nd Earl Leicester, founder of Garendon in 1133, to which donated his kinsmen, Hugh de Berges, and his son, Asketil.

Something else to consider is that the USA statesman Alexander Hamilton had Gilbert de Hamilton and other Scottish nobility as ancestors and that Alexander Hamilton is in the I-M223 group, which most in the Hamilton clan are not I-M223! Imposters? I’ll take a bet that they are because I-M223 is strongly associated with vikings, which is where both Alexander Hamilton and I could share ancestors. However, I also claim to have descended from Gilbert de Hamilton and I am of the group I-M223, like Alexander Hamilton, but not like other Hamiltons other than ancestral originators of the clan starting with Gilbert de Hamilton, who is sometimes called Gilbert de Hambledon.

The major difficulty to explain though is why am I a Hamilton, but when given a DNA test there are no other Hamiltons with my DNA that have been tested. One would think that if I am a Hamilton, there would be some other Hamiltons with my Y chromosomal DNA on record.

This is what I think my lineage is though based on the ancestry of Statesman Alexander Hamilton: 

These might be my ancestors.

Bernard "the Dane"

He is supposed to have been the ancestor of two great Anglo-Norman baronial families, the Beaumonts and the Harcourts. Bernard the Dane (French: Bernard le Danois) (c. 880 – before 960) was a Viking jarl (earl) of Danish origins.

1. Touroude (Torulf, Turulf) de PONTAUDEMER

2. Humphry de Belmont (Vaux). This is where I (Craig) am suggesting that I get my German Y-Chromosome from that I share with Statesman Alexander Hamilton, and my Y-chromosome with the Vance and Wentz surname.

3.Roger de Beaumont (de Belmont) (c. 1015 – 29 November 1094)

4. Robert 1st Earl of Leichester (de Beaumont)

5. Robert 2nd Earl of Leichester

6. Robert 3rd Earl of Leichester

7. William de Hambledon (de Breteuil)

8. Gilbert de Hamilton

9. Walter FitzGilbert de Hamilton, 1st of Cadzow

10. Sir David FitzWalter de Hamilton, 2nd of Cadzow (ancestor of Statesman Alexander Hamilton)

This page has some of Statesman Alexander Hamilton's ancestry:

https://famouskin.com/family-group.php?name=5876%20alexander%20hamilton&ahnum=262144&fbclid=IwAR2knbmAvzBnTorx18_F7dNsErbZOOfU51n87v91S0Wp4QEGwn70zhh3GBY

Back to Scotland again?

Had long thought I was Scottish (the Hamilton clan is the 2nd most noble clan in Scotland), then German as some people I'm closely related to are German, having the last name Wentz and thought to descend from "Good King Wenceslas" and the Will of the first USA Hamilton ancestor of mine is written in German, around the year 1776, but I still yet might be Scottish, because that is what was handed down verbally. I'm thinking my German ancestors crossed through Scotland.

I'm not a Hamilton, but a Vance though Hamilton is Scottish, while Vance can be Scottish or German. I have no Hamilton that I'm related to by DNA on DNA record that I know of. It just so happens that in 1770 the name Vans was changed to Vance in Scotland. Here is a link to the 
Vans crest: https://www.scotclans.com/scottish-cl…/clan-vans/vans-crest/

Why Vance and not Hamilton? My DNA shows many close genetic links, within a few generations, to both the Wentz and Vance family. Wentz is German however, but many Germans were given the Anglicized name Vance when they came to America. Both Vance and Wentz surnames must be related to me according to my DNA, but which country, as I am closely related to several people with the Wentz surname?
So German or Scottish, it's hard to say! Best support for the Scottish tale is that the 4 most closely related people to me have the last name Vance not Wentz, and their most distant ancestors do not have Wentz either, meaning their lineage is more closely Vance than Wentz. The DNA says this about my 4 closest Vance relatives "A 36/37 match between two men who share a common surname (or variant) indicates a close genealogical match. Very few people achieve this close level of a match, and it is within the range of most well-established surname lineages in Western Europe."

German Hamilton Line - Jacob Hamilton

Jacob was the first German Hamilton in America known that is a part of my genealogy.  He probably changed his name from Wence or Vance according to my Y Chromosomal DNA.

Jacob Hamilton seemed to appear out of nowhere. He first appears on the Perry County census in 1830, as age 20-30 with a wife age 20-30. He is listed as purchasing property April 1, 1834. He was a saddler by trade.

Jacob and Catherine are buried in the Liverpool, Pa. cemetery  in front of Christian and Annamarie Weirick stones. The will is written in German script and offers little biographical data.

Good King Wenceslas - Possible Y-DNA Royalty Link (Corrected)

My Y chromosomal DNA shows a strong connection to the German surname Vance, or Wentz.  The surname Wentz is thought to have a connection to various Deutch Kings.  My surname is Hamilton, but the Y DNA says I have a close connection to the surname Vance.  How close? 37 marker close at

37 MARKERS - 11 MATCHES to the of Vance or Wence.

According to Wikipedia: 

Y-DNA testing results are normally stated as probabilities: For example, with the same surname a perfect 37/37 marker test match gives a 95% likelihood of the most recent common ancestor (MRCA) being within 8 generations,^[22] while a 111 of 111 marker match gives the same 95% likelihood of the MRCA being within only 5 generations back.^[13]

[22] references www.familytreedna.com This is the company that did my Y chromosome DNA test.

What does it mean to me?  It's long shot, but there may be some relationship to German Royalty, or maybe a saint. Having the surname Vance/Wentz here are 4 males that match me within 1 of 37 markers, meaning 36/37 markers match; 2 matches within 2 of 37 markers or 35/37 markers match; 5 matches within 3 markers or 34/37 match. Those are the males with the surname Vance/Wentz that are very genetically close to me.  

More here:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Good_King_Wenceslas
"Good King Wenceslas" is a Christmas carol that tells a story of a Bohemian king going on a journey and braving harsh winter weather to give alms to a poor peasant on the Feast of Stephen (December 26, the Second Day of Christmas). During the journey, his page is about to give up the struggle against the cold weather, but is enabled to continue by following the king's footprints, step for step, through the deep snow. The legend is based on the life of the historical Saint Wenceslaus I, Duke of Bohemia or Svatý Václav in Czech (907–935). The name Wenceslas is a Latinised version of the old Czech language "Venceslav".

The Wentz/Wantz origin cut and pasted from http://vancehistoryonline.blogspot.com/p/short-history-of-vance-surname.html

Many of these families have traced their surname origins to original immigrants in the 18th or 19th century from Germany or Switzerland whose last name was Wentz or a variant like Wantz. In their new English-speaking home, the last name sounded like "Vance", and either through regular usage or by the pen of a government official the new spelling stuck.
Several books (see Online Books of Interest) describe the origin of the Wentz surname as a diminutive of "Wenceslaus" or the German variant "Wenzo", and track the name's association with a Saint Wendelin and of course several kings named Wenceslaus, with variants "Wenzelo" from 1198 through "Wenzel" in the 1300s. "Wentz" and "Wenz" were later variants appearing in the 1300s and 1400s near Basel in Switzerland and several locations in Germany. Other sources cite Slavic variants like Vaclav but agree on the same basic timeline.

The stories say an original Wentz family came out of Bohemia (part of the current Czech republic) or Pomerania (now part of Germany and Poland on the south Baltic Sea) and migrated into Bavaria in western Germany and to the city of Basel in Switzerland some 700 years ago. These stories have so far not been verified. In the 1700s and 1800s, however, several German and Swiss Wentz families immigrated to the US where the name became written as Vance.

Good King Wenceslas - Possible Y-DNA Royalty Link

My Y chromosomal DNA shows a strong connection to the German surname Vance, or Wentz.  The surname Wentz is thought to have a connection to various Deutch Kings.  My surname is Hamilton, but the Y DNA says I have a close connection to the surname Vance and Wentz.  How close? 37 marker close at

37 MARKERS - 8 MATCHES of which 7 have the surname Vance or Wentz.

According to Wikipedia: 

Y-DNA testing results are normally stated as probabilities: For example, with the same surname a perfect 37/37 marker test match gives a 95% likelihood of the most recent common ancestor (MRCA) being within 8 generations,^[22] while a 111 of 111 marker match gives the same 95% likelihood of the MRCA being within only 5 generations back.^[13]

[22] references www.familytreedna.com This is the company that did my Y chromosome DNA test.

What does it mean to me?  It's long shot, but there may be some relationship to German Royalty, or maybe a saint. 

More here:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Good_King_Wenceslas

The Wentz/Wantz origin cut and pasted from http://vancehistoryonline.blogspot.com/p/short-history-of-vance-surname.html

Many of these families have traced their surname origins to original immigrants in the 18th or 19th century from Germany or Switzerland whose last name was Wentz or a variant like Wantz. In their new English-speaking home, the last name sounded like "Vance", and either through regular usage or by the pen of a government official the new spelling stuck.
Several books (see Online Books of Interest) describe the origin of the Wentz surname as a diminutive of "Wenceslaus" or the German variant "Wenzo", and track the name's association with a Saint Wendelin and of course several kings named Wenceslaus, with variants "Wenzelo" from 1198 through "Wenzel" in the 1300s. "Wentz" and "Wenz" were later variants appearing in the 1300s and 1400s near Basel in Switzerland and several locations in Germany. Other sources cite Slavic variants like Vaclav but agree on the same basic timeline.

The stories say an original Wentz family came out of Bohemia (part of the current Czech republic) or Pomerania (now part of Germany and Poland on the south Baltic Sea) and migrated into Bavaria in western Germany and to the city of Basel in Switzerland some 700 years ago. These stories have so far not been verified. In the 1700s and 1800s, however, several German and Swiss Wentz families immigrated to the US where the name became written as Vance.